But Sir Nicholas told Harry he wouldn't come back.. :/ cant really believe that if he's really dead he can come =| but that veil must be explained very well or else I will always believe that :SBFC: is not dead!

I know that Harry and Luna heard but I was talking about the rest of them that were there fighting along with Sirius. If they were paying attention, they witnessed his death but never heard the voices that Harry and Luna heard....but that is a different topic...


*pokes you staying up on SS last night*

Okay!! Siriana, I luff you!! You are full of all kinds of things/knowledge aren't you??

Let's say if this were the truth, then JK would probably not tell us much more on the veil. The reason why I say that is because if we compare the veil to the Christian's beliefs then everyone will have their own guess just like we do now when someone dies. Everyone has their version as to what happens to someone's soul as they die. Maybe that is what JK is doing to us, letting us have our own version of what and where Sirius Black is....*looks at him next to me* *grabs my rope*

I think the veil is perhaps a portal that as of yet cannot be reached or returned from. There is death in JKR's books, but why would Sirius just fall through this veil and not be killed ending all speculation there? I think there is something of great importance there. Perhaps it too is a horcrux?

*hopes Siry grabs the rope*

*pokesluffsStaceyback*

I agree with what you say that Jk is letting us have our own version of what and where Sirius Black is.

I'm not comparing the veil with Christian beliefs. I'm just saying that people used to build edifices in places they thought as "sacred" from the beginning of time!!! Sacred doesn't have to be related to god or any religion whatsoever. I just used the christians as an example.

I also mentioned the pagans. In Greece, there's this place called the Oracle of Delphi that was thought to be the center of the world, I'm sure there are such places around the world and in most of cultures. If you visit this place you'll know what I mean.

But then again I'm talking about religions!!!!

I'm just adding something to the idea that there's some really big behind this veil.

Soz, if I'm going off topic but I just wanted to clear this, if I did (still dizzy)...

I believe that the veil is an entry to the other side. The spirit world is what lies on the other side and once you cross over I don't believe that there is a way to come back. Death is a journey that everyone must take and I think that the Veil is the beginning of that journey.

As to where it leads, I'm not sure. I suppose it can lead to many places or maybe you are just stuck behind the veil once you fall through. Maybe it leads to another dimension where your spirit will reside and watch over everything and everyone that you have left behind. Perhaps it is a way to keep in touch with the living world.

I have to wonder why are there stone benches all around the room and a path that leads to the stone dais where the Veil is. Perhaps this is a type of Death Penalty. Maybe Prisoners from Azkaban are taken to the Veil for execution. Perhaps the wizarding world believes that this form of execution is humane. No harm done, no torture, people fall through the veil and Seize to exist. Its simple and fast.

When Sirius fell through I believe it was the end for his life. He had served his purpose and it was his time to go. Harry and those who really cared for him knew he was innocent and that's all that mattered. Like JKR said death can be simple sometimes and that is what his Death was. It was simple. He fell through and that was it. He is gone and never to return. Sometimes death is too complicated, and with the veil it just happens. The feelings and emotions that people who are left behind are anything but simple. We make it difficult for ourselves because we have to have proof that someone is really gone, like a corpse or something. JKR is messing with our minds. He is gone and like the movie Dumbledore guy said, "No Spell can reawaken the dead." Ok then, but what can then if not a spell? Perhaps the only thing that can reawaken the dead is Voldemort falling through the Veil. Oh Happy Day! Sorry If I went off topic, but I tend to ramble.

Thats what I had in mind when I first read about that veil. Its a portal that leads to something that for the Ministry of Magic is still a mystery. That no one knows what can be found inside.
This is interesting.. it gives me a hope that somehow.. Sirius could still be seen by Harry in the future or that Sirius was still alive or that he was just there, stuck.. I dont know.. but I do want to believe, Sirius will be seen again at the last book. But JK says that Sirius is dead? aww.. I dont know what to think anymore..
You certainly got a point there. The veil remains a mystery and they consider it dangerous. I expect the seventh book will reaveal something about this veil.. its just too mysterious

Oh, I don't believe Sirius will "come back" as in real "come back." Neither do I think that he will become a ghost. By saying that he might come back as a "ghost or something" I merely meant the kind of ghost James and Lily were at the end of Goblet of Fire.

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Originally Posted by Stacey I know that Harry and Luna heard but I was talking about the rest of them that were there fighting along with Sirius. If they were paying attention, they witnessed his death but never heard the voices that Harry and Luna heard....but that is a different topic...

Ermmm – I meant that everyone witnessed his death but when Harry and Luna heard the voices, it was before Sirius had died. So no one had actually witnessed a death when Harry and Luna heard the voices.

[Wow - I'm going so off-topic. Sorry about that everyone]

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Originally Posted by Siriana I'm just adding something to the idea that there's some really big behind this veil

To that, we all agree. Something big and really bad.

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Originally Posted by Jordana I believe that the veil is an entry to the other side. The spirit world is what lies on the other side and once you cross over I don't believe that there is a way to come back. Death is a journey that everyone must take and I think that the Veil is the beginning of that journey.

Exactly what I wanted to say, Jordana. Sirius is just dead - The Veil is, most probably, a portal that leads to the spiritual world. [Which is just as bad as any other theory, because Sirius has to die in almost all of them ]

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I have to wonder why are there stone benches all around the room and a path that leads to the stone dais where the Veil is. Perhaps this is a type of Death Penalty. Maybe Prisoners from Azkaban are taken to the Veil for execution. Perhaps the wizarding world believes that this form of execution is humane. No harm done, no torture, people fall through the veil and Seize to exist. Its simple and fast.

I've thought about that too – After all, it was "The Death Chamber" wasn't it? But I felt that every second person in the Wizarding World would know about the Veil if it was used as a method of execution. Hermione would have read about it somewhere too.

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Perhaps the only thing that can reawaken the dead is Voldemort falling through the Veil.

*pushes Voldy throw the Veil* Now we'll just have to wait and see. He he – I just had to end this post on a happier note. All this discussion is a bit depressing. As Tina said - Touchy topic. XD

Maxie

Yes that is very true, and a very good point. But then again the U.S. Government and many other government bodies from other countries have many secrets that the people do not know about. Also if people in Azkaban and Ministry Workers are asked to sign a contract with a clause stating repercussions for them speaking about the Veil not many people would know about it. It is classified as top secret. Only people who have to know about it know about it. And if there were a leak, well then that's where the good old Obliviate Charm comes in handy.

To the only people that would be a threat to the disclosure of the Veil would be the prisoners and well, they won't be speaking to anyone after they fall through.

Also just because something exists, that doesn't necessarily mean that it will be written down somewhere. Especially not if the government doesn't want you to know about it, And the Veil is quite top secret so I don't believe that reading material containing any information about it would be available to young children/young adults like Hermione. She maybe smart but she doesn't know everything. Governments censor a lot from the people and I think the Ministry is doing that with the veil.

I thought of all that too, Jor. Good points. But I'm still rather inclined to think that the Ministry is trying to find out what the Veil does. It is possible, however, that the Ministry is using it as a method of "easy execution," even though it doesn't know what the Veil really is. So along with trying to find what the Veil could possibly be; it is also executing people through it – Or maybe just using to-be-executed prisoners as testers? *pokes Ministry*

Maxie

*dies of laughter*

Anyway, I agree with Heather. I thought it was an abyss at first. You know, oblivion. Fire and darkness and evil gnomes everywhere as you fell into nothingness. But then I decided I was being too morbid XD so not.

Soon, I reasoned that it looked like a foe glass, except there's a curtain covering the surface. But then again we'll never really know . . .

I still think there is something important about the veil. I find it hard to believe that Jo would leave it out of the last book. I know she probably will never be able to answer all of our questions, I am excited about the book and can't wait..

*hops up and down all excited like*

Lumus about hopping up and down. I agree about her including it though and that she probably won't be able to answer all our questions..

I always thought that the veil was just like a normal thing and if you look at it, it looks like a curtain is just hanging in midair, but when you fall into it, you fall into emptiness and you disappear forever *is that how she described it?* anyway thats always been my interpretation...

Of course there is something very important about the Veil. Jo might not be able to answer all our questions but she simply can't leave out the Veil. The Sirius Fans will riot – And she probably knows it too.

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*hops up and down all excited like*

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Originally Posted by gem I always thought that the veil was just like a normal thing and if you look at it, it looks like a curtain is just hanging in midair, but when you fall into it, you fall into emptiness and you disappear forever *is that how she described it?* anyway thats always been my interpretation...

There have been so many theories on what the Veil is. But what really bugs me now is – Where did it come from? Was it always there? Or did someone, maybe the Ministry, create it?

Maxie

I think its provenience is as enigmatic as the veil itself. I mean, seriously now, not even the Ministry has figured that out...=/ As to the question of its creation, I really don't think the Ministry could have created it; to me, the veil is an artifact as old as time, whose 'finding' circumstances are blurry. Then again, it can't have always been there, for that would mean that the MOM was founded on the exact vecinity of it, and that is just plain weird.

Definitely, the veil is and remains a mystery. It isn't in the Department of Mysteries + the Death Chamber just for art's sake. Beyond the veil lies death --or that's what JK is trying to suggest, in any case. But if people knew this fact (apart from the Ministry's officials, also Bella, Lupin and probably many more), why is it still kept there? And why is that room positioned like it is? And why the reference to the Wizengamot? I know some of you mentioned the veil being some sort of death sentence, but still...

And now that I reread this passage, I find it sadly ironic how Harry mentions Sirius' name on his first encounter with the veil:

ooc: Whoo, long post. <.<

even in the world of magic though, the veil is a mystery that lacks even some basic premise for it's existence. Was teh ministry built around the Dais with the archway, or was it something that is a secret as old as the ministry? It is a question that I fear will not be answered to our satisfaction.

i always thought of the Veil as a cross of the pensieve and the mirror of erised. You just see your most desired whatever in there but you cant get it just like that...unlike the pensieve where you just plunge into it and see a memory....maybe its a sort of mystical portal...

Maybe I could help a bit with the nothingness part. It might be a place where there is darkness all around and my poor Sirius is sitting there, struggling, struggling and struggling to get out – But he can't. At least this idea is one that has always excited me from the beginning.

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What purpose may it serve? As I said in answer to the first question, it maybe some sort of execution device. I'm sure Wizards have their own criminals that need to be disposed of. And since the Killing Curse is an Unforgivable One, they would need to find another way to kill criminals, ones that even Azkaban wouldn't be sufficient punishment for.

I do think that the Ministry might have other ways to execute criminals, but your theory is very probably. Maybe that is what the Veil is being used for, after all. Gosh, the Ministry must be really thankful it has such an easy way to execute people.

Maxie