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07-13-2005, 09:28 AM
| | | Why Harry Potter lost one reader
Yesterday's Ottawa Citizen contained a few articles on Harry Potter and the hype surrounding the latest book, with an ongoing series counting down the days til July 16. Most contain information that can be found in the SnitchSeeker News Forum, but one columnist feels the need to express certain shameful (to us, anyway) feelings.
In an article entitled "The awful truth: I won't buy sixth book", Christopher Shulgan details how he first fell in love with the series, and, over time, became dissatisfied with it. Quote:
Since I rediscovered fiction through Harry Potter, I've stuck with the series, but I didn't enjoy the past two books. J.K. Rowling has worked her magic too well. Her first three books pushed me to explore other fictional realms. These days I look for fast-paced stories told with inventive language. Neither of Potter's books four and five qualified.
Sure, they're fast-paced, but the writing's awful.
Quote:
With her fourth release, Rowling began a habit of modifying her speech verbs with adverbs. The habit worsened with the fifth instalment. Take page 318, which I've picked at random from the hardcover edition. The first line has a Hogwarts teacher verifying something Harry's just told him. Here's what Rowling writes:
"'Not feeling well?' he repeated hazily."
Rowling has Harry answer the professor "firmly." A few lines down Harry observes something "curtly" and the young wizard's next line of dialogue is said hastily, to which an observer quips snidely.
Quote:
At the best of times I don't feel particularly friendly to adverbs; I belong to a school of writing that says modifying a speaking verb with an adverb usually is unnecessary -- if the writer is doing his job properly, the reader should be able to tell how the dialogue is said just by what's being said.
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Adverbs aren't the only thing to sour me on Potter. Worse are the flabby plots in Potter books four and five. The fourth has a description of the World Cup of Quidditch splashed across a hundred pages, most of which could have been told in one-tenth the time through the sort of flashback exposition at which Rowling excels. I couldn't help wondering whether there was some merchandising reason for Rowling to go into such detail. Is it possible Rowling has a pathological hatred of trees? Or perhaps it's the Elvis principle.
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By now, perhaps Rowling is so surrounded by sycophantic editors and uxorious personal assistants that she can't accurately judge the worth of her own creative efforts. It happened to Elvis at Graceland, and judging from the tree-chomping length of the last couple volumes, it's happening to Rowling.
Quote:
I don't blame her. Neither C.S. Lewis nor the bard of Middle Earth himself, J.R.R. Tolkien, had to contend with managing a multi-platform corporate content juggernaut that Rowling, with her movies, video games and, oh yeah, those books, must manage as she writes. And perhaps that's the reason the quality of the series has decreased to the extent it has. Rowling probably needs a break, but she can't because a whole industry exists around this Potter dude. Here's hoping that once she's done the series, she goes back and redoes the series' last half, aided this time by an editor who will stand up to her. And perhaps then, I'll read her.
Quote:
So thank you, Harry and Ms. Rowling, for reintroducing me to the world of reading for pleasure. You did your job well -- for the most part.
Quote:
judging from the tree-chomping length of the last couple volumes
Yes. I suppose that's why an American group is urging US consumers to buy the forest-friendly Canadian edition. And it's also why Bloomsbury (who ships to the UK and Aus) is using forest-friendly paper too.
And adverbs?! I'll need a better argument than that.
But that's just my opinion
Source: www.ottawacitizen.com |
07-13-2005, 09:42 AM
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#2 (permalink)
| Dog Star Owner Hippogriff
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: kissing posters of E
Posts: 3,531
| WHAT? what's wrong with using a lot of adverbs? isn't that good? you can't just expect it to be 'said Harry.' all the time! *rolls eyes* hehe Canada is forest-friendly, eh? i live in Canada... WOO HOO! yay first to post
Last edited by padfoot_rox93; 07-13-2005 at 09:44 AM.
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07-13-2005, 09:51 AM
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#3 (permalink)
| | Ramora
Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: unable to locate
Posts: 372
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i think he's a person who's taking advantage of this month's limelight on HP books. he just wants to be known. i mean really...
even if it was gramatical errors, its the stories that count. i mean my cousin has a beautiful imagination and her stories are great! but her grammer's need a few adjusting. yes-yes, Ms J.K Rowling should be professional about it, but dont you think she would have done it on purpose?
i mean after's she finished typing them, she has to pass it on to her editor. so, either 'he/she' missed it or it was on purpose.
__________________ "Back and Forth together again." Kenjiro. |
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07-13-2005, 09:56 AM
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#4 (permalink)
| | Chizpurfle
Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Germany
Posts: 699
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The adverbs-argument is a bit strange ...
Okay you read a fantasy book to imagine the world for yourself but what is wrong with using some adverbs ?
It really helps to understand or imagine things in a better way.
I agree with him that this whole hype and the pressure JK has to suffer from makes the books maybe not as good as if they would be if JK has more time to write them but that's no reason to quit reading completely, is it ?
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07-13-2005, 10:01 AM
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#5 (permalink)
| | Grindylow
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 931
| Say what?!? adverbs? That's all he could find for not reading Harry Potter and the Half Blood Price? That's pathetic if you ask me. |
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07-13-2005, 10:27 AM
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#6 (permalink)
| | Demiguise
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: look behind you....b
Posts: 5,280
Hogwarts RPG Name: Amelia Genevieve Laurent Ministry RPG Name:
Susan Mary Peters International Cooperation |
It doesn't make sense. Oh well, his lost  He doesn't know what he's gonna miss...
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07-13-2005, 10:30 AM
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#7 (permalink)
| | Acromantula
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 10,442
| Kitty Momma Rachel's Brain Twin
in my opinion he has got quite a bit of loose bolts in his head or lost too many brain cells... to many adverbs... honestly.. is that the best he excuse he can think of?
anyway.
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07-13-2005, 10:39 AM
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#8 (permalink)
| | Banshee
Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: scotland, the counry
Posts: 16,448
| Keeper of Mr Tennant's specs
What a lode of rubbish.. in my opinions the first two books were and are the weekst of them so far POA, GOF and OOTP are the best books... mmmm
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07-13-2005, 10:41 AM
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#9 (permalink)
|  cookie loving Slytherin Crup
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: VA
Posts: 2,355
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Actually, I sort of agree with his whole bit against using adverbs in place of speech verbs. Sure, sometimes it's okay, but constantly? It does get a bit annoying after a while, but something like that's not going to stop me from reading the sixth book. In school, English teachers like to stress the use of adverbs so that students will use more vocabulary. But he has a great point...a good author shouldn't feel need to do this as much because everything around the dialogue should be able to demonstrate how the character is reacting. There's really nothing wrong with using adverbs, but there's seriously no need to use them all the time.
However, I don't agree with the length bit. The longer the books, the better. She does go into lots of detail and into some tangents, but it's never, ever boring and there are clues and hints everywhere that she probably needs to put in there. Every book is packed with more information, so I think it only makes sense for each book to be a little longer (although we all know HBP isn't quite as long as OotP).
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07-13-2005, 10:55 AM
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#10 (permalink)
|  I'm back! Kappa
Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 1,020
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Although he makes an interesting point, I don't agree. I think it's good she used adverbs. I use them a lot too when I write. It's fun to add a little something to describe how something's being said or the char's facial expression when he says it. The books are great and I don't think the two last books were bad at all.
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07-13-2005, 11:07 AM
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#11 (permalink)
| Portuguese Moderator Thestral
Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Neverland
Posts: 39,664
Hogwarts RPG Name: Margaret Jacqueline Atkinson Morris Fifth Year | Potter’s Princess A+ FangGirl
This guy isn't thinking well...
__________________ I gotta go back to the muggle world,
they're gonna try and tell me this wasn't, that none of this happened,
but you know what? It was real. It did happen.
We spent time here. We made friends here. That's a part of us.
Cause Hogwarts is bigger than any of us, of any of it's founders,
and it's going to be around long after we're gone.
Maybe we'll see our kids come here one day.
That's the thing about Hogwarts.
No matter how long you're away from it, there's always a way back. |
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07-13-2005, 11:31 AM
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#12 (permalink)
| | Faerie
Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Norway
Posts: 4,005
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Actually I agree with this person that she does a bit too much "said Harry hazily", "said McGonagal sternly", "said Dumbledore Forcefully" etc.
Sometimes it's enough without it.
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What the BEEP is going on?
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07-13-2005, 11:38 AM
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#13 (permalink)
| | Poltergeist
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK
Posts: 17,097
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Kaplinski Rival Sorting Hat Machine
Maybe she uses adverbs so younger audiences understand what's being said. I can understand and appreciate what he's saying; punctuation, the pace of words, the length of sentences, syllables, the types of words chosen etc ... can show how a line is said in place of an adverb. But maybe those aren't as easy to understand as blatantly stating how a character says something. While the series grows and the target age grows, Rowling still has to acknowledge that kids from 10 - 12 read the books.
Last edited by EmmaRiddle; 07-13-2005 at 11:43 AM.
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07-13-2005, 11:42 AM
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#14 (permalink)
| | Guest |
What's wrong with the Quidditch World Cup scene? I doubt a flashback would have worked well. How could you ever describe the excitement of a World Cup through a flashback?
But, I've also read an article lately, specifically on writing, and it too says to stay away from adverbs as much as possible. | |
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07-13-2005, 11:43 AM
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#15 (permalink)
| | Plimpy
Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Liddypool
Posts: 1,163
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Oh noes, attack of the adverbs! I've noticed it, but I don't mind it that much. JK's got plenty of pressure on her back nowadays. I'm not going to freak out just because of a few misplaced parts of speech.
Please, keep reading the books. They have a good message.
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07-13-2005, 11:44 AM
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#16 (permalink)
| | Poltergeist
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK
Posts: 17,097
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Kaplinski Rival Sorting Hat Machine
Another point I think is fair to make is that sometimes (at least this is true for me) writers don't consciously make decisions over what type of grammar and forms they use. They just spring from the pen, onto the paper. So the use of the adverbs may not be a conscious thing at all. In which case, if it is 'bad', it's down to the editor to spot it.
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07-13-2005, 11:52 AM
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#17 (permalink)
| Keeper of the G/H snog Clabbert
Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Cairo , Egypt...
Posts: 2,436
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May be he is right..but this is not a thing to not read the books. It doesn't matter much. When we read, we concentrate on the events not on the punctuation or any thing else. Besides as every one said that there are children read these books and also this isn't a Governmental speech to look careful inside it.
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07-13-2005, 12:03 PM
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#18 (permalink)
| | Flobberworm
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 24
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I don't understand how you can complain about the world cup scene and then induce that J.R.R.Tolkien is a better writer. I think that you are fishing for attention. I personally do not care how many adverbs a writer uses.
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07-13-2005, 12:14 PM
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#19 (permalink)
| | Flobberworm
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 17
| It's his lost for not reading the sixth book!
__________________ My Life can't get any worse only better! |
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07-13-2005, 12:15 PM
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#20 (permalink)
| | Crup
Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Lurking
Posts: 2,107
| In Love with Touz | | Lil Mikky-Mu Quote:
Actually, I sort of agree with his whole bit against using adverbs in place of speech verbs. Sure, sometimes it's okay, but constantly? It does get a bit annoying after a while, but something like that's not going to stop me from reading the sixth book.
That was my problem with is opinion, too. I can see his point, and I did notice the use of adverbs seemed to increase, but if he's that allergic to them... I say (sarcastically) that we write him (crossly) about what we think (honestly) of him.
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07-13-2005, 12:57 PM
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#21 (permalink)
| | Imp
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 121
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verry good
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07-13-2005, 01:14 PM
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#22 (permalink)
| | Horklump
Join Date: May 2005 Location: ACT, Australia
Posts: 46
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personally i think that if you are reading a book for enjoyment then u really shouldnt be worrying about the amount of adverbs that is on a single page... im perfectly hapy with just following the story along... and yes i did advanced english, lol!
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07-13-2005, 01:21 PM
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#23 (permalink)
| | Phoenix
Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: CrazyTown
Posts: 15,955
| The Sweetest Thing Lissy De Vil Quote:
And adverbs?! I'll need a better argument than that.
But that's just my opinion
Me too. Quote:
Another point I think is fair to make is that sometimes (at least this is true for me) writers don't consciously make decisions over what type of grammar and forms they use. They just spring from the pen, onto the paper. So the use of the adverbs may not be a conscious thing at all. In which case, if it is 'bad', it's down to the editor to spot it.
Once again I agree with you Emma!
So who cares if this guy reads the book? It's his right. There will be plenty of other people who do. It's also his right to not like the books, however, methinks he may be enjoying the attention that jumping on the hate HP bandwagon brings...? Hmmmm?
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07-13-2005, 01:33 PM
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#24 (permalink)
| Dark Force Defence League  Demiguise
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: My own little world!
Posts: 5,145
| Crazy Hufflepuffian Sirius 'bout Sirius Quote:
At the best of times I don't feel particularly friendly to adverbs; I belong to a school of writing that says modifying a speaking verb with an adverb usually is unnecessary -- if the writer is doing his job properly, the reader should be able to tell how the dialogue is said just by what's being said.
Ummm....just run the lot of that by me again because i didnt understand a word of it. I dont care how its written just as long as its got a great story line. Whats the matter with these people! I mean your talking about the book that has introduced millions of children to reading for pleasure so dont knock it matey!
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Last edited by Kitty Loves Steps; 07-13-2005 at 01:35 PM.
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07-13-2005, 01:57 PM
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#25 (permalink)
| | Skrewt
Join Date: May 2005 Location: Av and sig by Ama
Posts: 1,401
| Call me Trouble
Sounds stupid!The first three books were good because they weren't having adverbs,ha!I thod they were considered for kids cause they weren't having!Anyway,who doesn't like it,shouldn't read it!
Only my opinian!
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