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Old 08-03-2005, 12:19 PM
EmmaRiddle EmmaRiddle is offline
 
Post HBP & the great shipping debate

The San Francisco Chronicle has an interesting article about shipping within the Harry Potter fandom and how 'Half-Blood Prince' has affected the way shippers view the novels. The article mainly focuses on Hr/H shippers. It refers to what happened in the sixth book in terms of ships and also mentions the interview between Jo Rowling, Melissa and Emerson, in which Hr/H shippers were referred to as 'delusional'.

Quote:
Instead, it's caused an eruption of fannish dismay. "That woman has completely destroyed my faith in ever having a real relationship," opined one Harry/Hermione 'shipper on an online message board. Another pronounced the book "a large, steaming pile of decaying crap."
Quote:
Anelli, 25, who works as a journalist when she isn't overseeing the Leaky Cauldron, says that most abuse came from a small faction of vociferous fans. "They've lost the ability to divorce themselves between what J.K. Rowling is doing and what they'd like to see happen, and they've taken their disappointment and projected it onto her," she says. "I can totally understand how you could be upset if your preference didn't happen, but I can't understand or tolerate that people who claim to be her fans can be so mean to her."
Quote:
"I was surprised," says Spartz, 18, of the furious response. "But in hindsight, I shouldn't have been. I forgot how emotionally invested these 'shippers get. I knew they weren't going to be happy ... but I did not see it generating this much hate." He adds, "Romance in the books is the most prominent source of debate in the online fandom, where many of the fans border on obsessive, but casual readers will never understand what the big deal is."
Source: HPANA
Old 08-03-2005, 10:26 PM   #51 (permalink)
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You would think it'd be over...but...Rejecting her writing is completly uncalled for
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Old 08-03-2005, 10:41 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by indi4n
this is jus stupid, jus leave JKR, its all fiction, get over it
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Old 08-03-2005, 10:46 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Instead, it's caused an eruption of fannish dismay. "That woman has completely destroyed my faith in ever having a real relationship," opined one Harry/Hermione 'shipper on an online message board. Another pronounced the book "a large, steaming pile of decaying crap."
I have the huge erge to just say have a cry because you can't change it. Who said that R/Hr can't have a real relationship? It is clear that they will so people are just going to have to deal with it. They can't be very good fans if they let "a ship gone wrong" to them hate Harry Potter...there is more to the books than that. geeeeez!

Quote:
Romance in the books is the most prominent source of debate in the online fandom, where many of the fans border on obsessive, but casual readers will never understand what the big deal is."
I'm obsessive but I just think any relationship is cute! H/Hr brother sister thing is just tehee and R/Hr romance thing is like yaaaaaaaaay! I think the big deal is embarrassment...finding out that you are wrong. But if you accept it then noone cares!

*shrugs* just my opinion, I probably sound like a cow or something since I just got up but whatever...
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Old 08-04-2005, 01:04 AM   #54 (permalink)
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I was disappointed to see the outcome of the 'ships in HBP, but that's life. My only objections are being called "delusional", and some of the aforementioned comments coming from her "fans". After reading the TLC/MN interview, I was frankly quite turned-off from mugglenet: I'm so glad none of the staff here speak to/of the members like he did.
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Old 08-04-2005, 01:30 AM   #55 (permalink)
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woosh!!!!!!
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Old 08-04-2005, 02:01 AM   #56 (permalink)
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That is just pathetic... over a shipper?
jeeeze
some people realy need to grow up and stop acting like little babies about this.
and thats my opinion.
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Old 08-04-2005, 02:16 AM   #57 (permalink)

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Wow this is the second ridiculus article about Harry Potter I read this week. Wow I can't believe some H/H shippers talk like that about the book just because of that. The books aren't all about the romance. Geesh.
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Old 08-04-2005, 05:31 AM   #58 (permalink)


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"They've lost the ability to divorce themselves between what J.K. Rowling is doing and what they'd like to see happen, and they've taken their disappointment and projected it onto her," she says.
That is so true. And you know what? If you don't like JK's canon shippings...read and write fanfiction! And get over it! Because she's the author, and these are HER characters.

There's nothing at all wrong with being a H/Hr shipper. I don't think H/Hr shippers are 'delusional' at all. I don't think Hr/D or GW/NL shippers are 'delusional' either. Because anyone can participate in any ship that they like, especially since we have fanfiction to delve into. But when it comes to the canon series...calm down. People need stop acting like spoiled 8-year-olds and start appreciating the fact that JK Rowling is writing the series the way she likes it, and is not giving into fan pressure to ship one way or another.

Finally, other things happened in the book too, you know. It wasn't all about romance! There was plenty of action and drama, too. There's no rule or law that says that fans have to be completely obsessed and focused on the raging hormones of the characters. It's okay to become obsessed with other aspects of the series, too!
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Old 08-04-2005, 07:36 AM   #59 (permalink)
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Jo doesn't listen to any of this and she never will. She won't ever let it affect her writing.
They need to simmer.
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Old 08-04-2005, 09:57 AM   #60 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcella_Riddle
In Emerson's defence (and I say this because I agree with him) the use of the word 'delusional' isn't an insult; it's correct english. The term delusional means to imagine something that isn't there. That's exactly what Hr/H shippers did.
That's true, but then she had so many opportunities to deny H/Hr outright in the past - as she did with N/G - and she left so many red herring that to call H/Hr shippers "delusional", even indirectly, is insulting our collective intelligence, because there WAS something there but it was a shoal of red herrings.
There WERE non-plot H/G clues, such as Harry's dream about Neville dancing with Sprout, but then what about Cho turning into Hermione? This is what I mean. People are acting like H/Hr shippers are and have always been a pack of stubborn fools just based on the behaviour of a tiny minority of us.

A true shipper accepts when their ship has sailed, or that it will never be seaworthy.


That's because you're a real fan of the books who acknowledges that romance isn't the be-all-and-end-all.



Revenge? Oh I'd quite agree. I've visited several sites/forums and some of the stuff I've seen is nothing short of horrific.



You were, however, bad-mouthing Jo. When she did nothing wrong.[/QUOTE]
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Old 08-04-2005, 10:07 AM   #61 (permalink)


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That's true, but then she had so many opportunities to deny H/Hr outright in the past - as she did with N/G - and she left so many red herring that to call H/Hr shippers "delusional", even indirectly, is insulting our collective intelligence, because there WAS something there but it was a shoal of red herrings.
She had chances but if she had, then there would've been no excitement left. We all know the fiercest debates were between R/Hr's and Hr/H's. To end all that before the book release would've been a bad move. I see your point; Hr/H wasn't as ridiculous as Luna/Neville, which Jo promptly sunk because it was going nowhere and letting people go down that road was pointless. But I don't think she was calling anyone any names, even indirectly.

Quote:
There WERE non-plot H/G clues, such as Harry's dream about Neville dancing with Sprout, but then what about Cho turning into Hermione? This is what I mean.
And the dream about her performance on a broom . You could argue Hr/H wasn't always impossible but from GoF and when Jo explicitly said 'Platonic' it was pretty much spelt out that it was R/Hr.
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Old 08-04-2005, 10:24 AM   #62 (permalink)
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People are acting like H/Hr shippers are and have always been a pack of stubborn fools just based on the behaviour of a tiny minority of us.
But a lot of H/Hr shippers, including yourself, refused to listen to JKR. "Harry and Hermione are very platonic friends." So what was the excuse? "She was talking about PoA." "Does Hermione like Ron more than a friend? 'The answer is in Goblet of Fire!'" The excuse? "Yes, but later on..." "'And he's snogging with Hermione?' 'Harry and Hermione? Do you think so? Ron and Hermione, I would say, there's more tension there.'" The excuse? "She was just surprised to be asked that!"

I think she sufficiently sunk H/Hr, but no one would listen and as the shipping wars got more fierce, and the question wouldn't die, she decided to say nothing at all. But had she said it before, would the result be any more different? She pretty much has said R/Hr, and everyone refused to believe it...
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Old 08-04-2005, 12:04 PM   #63 (permalink)
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I'm not a shipper at all, but I think it's quite pathetic and immature to get heated and hating just because something you devoted almost your entire life towards, didn't actually happen. These characters are fictional. And unless you're the one writing the book, you have no say whatsoever in who dates who, you have no say in anything that happens. To devote your life and time and energy towards something like ships, it's pathetic. To get all heated and hating because it didn't go your way, is pathetic.

The more I think about it, the more these people are counting their chickens before they've hatched. How do they know that JK isn't planning to break-up Harry/Ginny, Ron/Hermione in the 7th book? They don't. So why get all heated and hating towards JK? I understand that they're upset, but these shippers can't change anything. They've just got to calm down and learn to live and accept the fact that things didn't go the way that they wanted, and they can't always have what they want. Nobody gets what they always want.

Don't hate JK and don't desert her or her books. You loved them previously, why start hating them now? And as for this quote,


Quote:
"That woman has completely destroyed my faith in ever having a real relationship"
I personally hope that one day they fall upon what I'm about to say. You're a moron. A pathetic moron. To say that because of something that happened in a fictional book, that you'll never have a real relationship, is completely stupid. It's a fictional book. Not a book about your life and how it spoke about how you won't have a real relationship. But I must admit, I will have a giggle at the thought of you making out with someone, with the thought of Hermione and Ron snogging at the back of your mind.
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Old 08-04-2005, 05:44 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tao
But a lot of H/Hr shippers, including yourself, refused to listen to JKR. "Harry and Hermione are very platonic friends." So what was the excuse? "She was talking about PoA." "Does Hermione like Ron more than a friend? 'The answer is in Goblet of Fire!'" The excuse? "Yes, but later on..." "'And he's snogging with Hermione?' 'Harry and Hermione? Do you think so? Ron and Hermione, I would say, there's more tension there.'" The excuse? "She was just surprised to be asked that!"
I don't think that those responses were so unreasonable. I mean, she did leave that ambiguity.
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Old 08-04-2005, 10:07 PM   #65 (permalink)
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No. I think calling Harry and Hermione platonic friends should've been a huge anvail. Along with her reaction to the Harry and Hermione snogging deal and then saying R/Hr had the tension. (What did you think? "Oh, who cares if they have the tension it's still H/Hr!"?) It was quite obvious who she was writing for from her words. It seems to me that after years of pretty much saying R/Hr without coming right out and saying it, she got fed up with the fact that no one would listen to her and kept asking that question. She was only more ambiguous in the last few times she was asked.

There's even... "Was it just me or was there something going on between Ron and Hermione the last half of GoF? 'Yes there is 'something going on' but Ron doesn't get it yet. Typical boy.'" How much more did you need? She spelled it out without even saying and everyone ignored her.

I mean even you yourself had convinced yourself that it meant nothing. That it was just in GoF she was talking about. Like somehow there was going to be this great triangle where Ron loved Hermione, Hermione loved Harry, and Harry loved his broom. And all because she didn't show Hermione jealous in OotP.

Honestly, I think JKR had said it dozens of times about R/Hr and the books had those clues too. Sure, maybe there were red herrings for H/Hr - if you looked for them - which is what JKR is saying, but ignoring the obvious clues for R/Hr... whether the books or what she said in interviews... I think people have no one to blame but themselves for feeling let down and hurt.
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Old 08-04-2005, 10:08 PM   #66 (permalink)
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I personally am a SS/HG shipper...or maybe that should be a SS/SW shipper! Seriously though, J.K. should write what she wants, I think those girls need to go and see someone, they've got BIG problems! I'd still love the books even if no one got together!
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Old 08-06-2005, 06:00 AM   #67 (permalink)
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I'm not a shipper...so any talk botu fighting shippers makes me laugh
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Old 08-06-2005, 11:01 PM   #68 (permalink)
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I read this article a few days ago..or was it yesterday...?
I was always a R/HR shipper. I do feel bad for the H/HR shippers but, not to be rude, it is just a book...no need to hate Jo (for those who do).

Quote:
Instead, it's caused an eruption of fannish dismay. "That woman has completely destroyed my faith in ever having a real relationship,"
How can someone say that? I don't even know what to say to that. Just...wow...weird...
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In conclusion, Terry Pratchett is a prat...no really it's in his name. *fires cannons*

lol That made me laugh.

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Old 08-08-2005, 08:57 PM   #69 (permalink)
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imma a ron and hermione shipper and i kinda understand if the harry/hermione shippers are mad but the romance isnt a really important part of the book SOME of them are getting overly angry. personally im more sad that one of of my favorite charactars(sp?) died........
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Old 08-11-2005, 01:01 AM   #70 (permalink)
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I frankly think Emerson is well within his right to use the word "delusional". It's called freedom of speech and protected by the First Amendment in the United States (the exact technicality may be different in various countries but I believe all liberal democracies have some sort of law protecting freedom of expression). Rowling is also well within her right, either as an author or an individual, for not contradicting Emerson's comment. After all, she believes that she has given ample clues as to where things are going - romance wise - in her books. Finally, they're her books - she may well do whatever she pleases.

Others may or may not like what Emerson said or what Rowling decided to do with her books, but that's not an excuse for hateful messages that have been springing up over the past few weeks. Keep in mind a recent example of intolerance of others' opinions - the murder of Dutch film maker Theo van Gogh. While it's true that anonymous hateful messages on the internet are significantly less serious than murder, they both are motivated by similar intolerance and fanaticism.
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