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| | The Half-Blood Prince Harry's 6th year at Hogwarts - who is the Prince? | Have a very Harry day!!
07-26-2005, 12:20 PM
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#1 (permalink)
|  Jr. Lord of Arda Erumpent
Location: Melbourne, Australia Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 13,203
| Missing Sentence It was recently discovered that one sentence from the American version of HBP does not appear in the UK version. This sentence is quite ...interesting and I thought we could discuss what it could possibly mean: Quote:
"I can help you, Draco."
"No, you can't," said Malfoy, his wand shaking very badly indeed.
Nobody can. He told me to do it or he'd kill me. I've got no choice."
"He cannot kill you if you are already dead. Come over to the right side, Draco, and we can hide you more completely than you can possibly imagine."" (HBP pg 591/552)
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Last edited by Rovie : 07-26-2005 at 12:28 PM.
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07-26-2005, 12:28 PM
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#2 (permalink)
| The Sweetest Thing Dumbledove The Precious One Veela
Location: Cuddling Joe Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 14,399
| Very interesting omission indeed!! Accidental? Who knows. But it does change the feel of the conversation quite a bit. I took it when I read that part that Dumbledore was referring to the fact that a person loses part of their soul when they kill someone. Thus, "He cannot kill you if you are already dead." You've already sacrificed part of yourself by doing the act. Being a DE and killing is as good as being dead you might say. Your soul will never be complete again.
Now quite a different theory may refer to Dumbledore's death. Could this mean something there? He cannot kill you if you are already dead... Are we going to theorize that Dumbledore was hiding something? Perhaps Snape killing him was not what it appeared to be (which I felt anyway)? DD already seemed to be at the point of death due to the potion he drank. But I'm not sure that there were hints that he was already dead at that point. The painting of him appeared after, when MacGonagall took his office. Must read more...
Last edited by Lissydove : 07-26-2005 at 12:36 PM.
Reason: Sorry - added more theory....
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07-26-2005, 12:39 PM
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#3 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | I felt that could mean that he can't kill you if you're already dead; if you appear to be dead and Voldemort thinks you are, then he can't kill you. I thought of that because straight after that DD mentions putting him in hiding, which is what you'd do if you feigned someone's death. In which case, that could reflect on what happened to DD. |
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07-26-2005, 12:48 PM
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#4 (permalink)
| Gangsta Kappa
Location: THE OC~SOCAL haLLa! Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,006
| I took it to mean that if Voldemort thought Draco to be dead then Draco wouldnt have to worry about being killed by Voldemort. |
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07-26-2005, 02:13 PM
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#5 (permalink)
| | Glumbumble
Location: Rennes, boaring town in France Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 188
| I really don't know what this sentence means! it mad more sens without it! Then know it seem very importante"He cannot kill you if you are already dead." Does that mean Draco is believed dead? or that draco is really dead and he was a memory like Tom Riddle in the chamber of secrets or something? I personnaly think that the first proposition is better, but like they are links between the 2 books... |
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07-26-2005, 02:24 PM
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#6 (permalink)
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Location: *~In a world of my [o w n]~* Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 140
| It's all very confusing, you see, because it implies that Dumbledore is suggesting feigning Draco's death.
Unless he means to turn the tables, and is speaking in his usual limericks... so you see, it raises more questions than answers.. o.O |
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07-26-2005, 02:27 PM
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#7 (permalink)
| Head MM&SI Mod WWW Mod Humble Badger Troll
Location: Mtns of E. TN Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,852
Hogwarts RPG Name: Remus Viktor Lupin Fifth Year | I think it means Dumbledore at that moment getting ready to fake his own death. I can't believe I missed that sentence it is huge. Must complete rereading the sections first before I make a theory on what else it might mean. |
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07-26-2005, 02:33 PM
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#8 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Quote: |
It's all very confusing, you see, because it implies that Dumbledore is suggesting feigning Draco's death.
| Exactly. But what he says, "He can't kill you if you are already dead," seems odd when you take into account what happened next and the planned sense of it all. Quote: |
I think it means Dumbledore at that moment getting ready to fake his own death.
| Bingo; Andrew hit the nail on the head. It implies that death can be feigned in order to make Voldemort no longer need to 'kill' the person. You can't kill someone whom you already believe to be dead. Given what happens to DD next, that sentence can hold a lot of meaning. |
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07-26-2005, 02:41 PM
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#9 (permalink)
| Head MM&SI Mod WWW Mod Humble Badger Troll
Location: Mtns of E. TN Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,852
Hogwarts RPG Name: Remus Viktor Lupin Fifth Year | Or Emma, it could mean Dumbledore has helped fake someone else's death and Voldemort is no longer trying to kill that person...or it could mean both. This is huge. |
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07-26-2005, 02:47 PM
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#10 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Well, he was implying that's what he could do for Draco which might mean he's done it in the past. |
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07-26-2005, 03:08 PM
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#11 (permalink)
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Location: *contorts face trying to remember* Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 386
| This is so infuriating! This totally changes my view on the events that occurred near the end of the book. Maybe, just maybe, Dumbledore isn't referring to himself; maybe he's helped a certain R.A.B... Either way, this totally changes everything. |
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07-26-2005, 03:30 PM
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#12 (permalink)
| | Faerie
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,001
| it is a definate pointer on helping draco and hiding him but dumbledore hinting on his own death is plain wierd seeing dd had a pleading note in hs voice when he saw snape...........i certainly hope it was a faker but it'l ruin the tempo of the book!! |
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07-26-2005, 03:47 PM
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#13 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Dumbledore wouldn't plead for his life. "Death, to the well organised mind, is the next greatest adventure." |
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07-26-2005, 03:55 PM
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#14 (permalink)
| | Bicorn
Location: !. . .The Windy City. . .! Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,850
| He cannot kill you if you are already dead. Quote: |
I think it means Dumbledore at that moment getting ready to fake his own death.
| Maybe Dumbledore already knew Voldemort wanted him dead so maybe he really did fake his death. Im going to go re read that part because i'm making myself more confused the more I try to remember how that whole part goes. . . |
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07-26-2005, 03:58 PM
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#15 (permalink)
| | Faerie
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,001
| But he wanted Snape to remain on his side and thats why he pleaded with him. I really want to know whether Snape told DD about the Unbreakable Vow he made with Narcissa. |
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07-26-2005, 04:20 PM
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#16 (permalink)
| Dog Star Owner Hippogriff
Location: kissing posters of Eminem... it's not weird. Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,536
| hee hee hee hee funny hee hee hee maybe the printers turned evil and decided to not print that sentence. *runs off and makes up crazy theories*  |
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07-26-2005, 04:26 PM
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#17 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Quote: |
Maybe Dumbledore already knew Voldemort wanted him dead so maybe he really did fake his death.
| DD knew of the plan. He told Draco he knew about it but couldn't talk to him prior to their encounter because Voldemort would get it out of Malfoy. Quote: |
But he wanted Snape to remain on his side and thats why he pleaded with him. I really want to know whether Snape told DD about the Unbreakable Vow he made with Narcissa.
| The argument they had that Hagrid overheard more or less confirms that he did. Although I think DD and Snape made an unbreakable vow when he returned to the good side so that Snape would have no chance of returning to Voldemort properly without dying. |
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07-26-2005, 05:10 PM
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#18 (permalink)
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Location: Lost in a Lifeboat Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 590
| Wow.... Just, wow... That sentence is in MY book (w00t, I'm a lucky American!) and I coudl have told you guys it was there... Looks like a pretty big over-sight to leave out an entire sentence... I never really, you know, thought about it... "He cannot kill you if you're already dead" was something I forgot about after the real death occured. For me, this just raises questions about how many times before Dumbledore has freigned someone's death! And, come to think of it, just how good it he at doing so? JKRowling is probably laughing at us right now... |
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07-26-2005, 05:15 PM
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#19 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Cackling more like. ^^^ |
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07-26-2005, 05:18 PM
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#20 (permalink)
| The Sweetest Thing Dumbledove The Precious One Veela
Location: Cuddling Joe Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 14,399
| I'll make her cackle a little more... ... or groan a bit! If this is an implication about faking death, and we wonder who DD has helped fake death before... Well... Let's think on that RAB again. Regulus Black is the front runner in the RAB theory, but he is supposed to be dead, right? Maybe not! (I could only wish it was his brother who faked his death *sniff*) Maybe DD makes a point of reforming ex-DE's?
Last edited by Lissydove : 07-26-2005 at 05:31 PM.
Reason: making my thoughts a bit clearer
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07-26-2005, 05:18 PM
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#21 (permalink)
| *dreamy face* Dugbog
Location: istanbul, turkey Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 634
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by Marcella_Riddle I felt that could mean that he can't kill you if you're already dead; if you appear to be dead and Voldemort thinks you are, then he can't kill you. | yea i agree. i think he was thinking of hiding draco and his family until the DE's came  i hate snape |
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07-26-2005, 05:24 PM
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#22 (permalink)
| Tennant Tennant TennantInspirational Pogrebin
Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 11,523
Hogwarts RPG Name: Marcella Riddle Graduated | Sirius would have no reason for his to be feigned. His death wasn't planned or anything. To feign a death you'd have to know there were plans for the person to die before-hand.
It's sort of like Slughorn in a way. When Harry and DD arrived he'd feigned a DE attack. Could also explain the disappearances of Ollivander and Florean and maybe the 'deaths' of Emmeline and Amelia. I don't but that's a different can of worms.
Last edited by EmmaRiddle : 07-26-2005 at 05:28 PM.
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07-26-2005, 05:28 PM
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#23 (permalink)
| The Sweetest Thing Dumbledove The Precious One Veela
Location: Cuddling Joe Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 14,399
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by Marcella_Riddle Sirius would have no reason for his to be feigned. His death wasn't planned or anything. To feign a death you'd have to know there were plans for the person to die before-hand. |  But I said I could only * wish* that was the case! I know it wasn't planned! As for his bro... He could be an interesting position to do damage to Voldemort if Voldie thinks he is dead...
Oh wait, I see I goofed when I posted before... The 'maybe not' was referring to Regulus... I'll fix it... |
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07-26-2005, 05:35 PM
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#24 (permalink)
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Location: 93 Diagon Alley Weasley's Wizarding Wheezes~Fred and George's uhh..favorite..customer;) Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 263
| my impression when i read that line was that Dumbledore meant Voldemort can't kill Draco if Draco joins the RIGHT side(meaning if he let go of his dark n evil side..like making that side of him DIE) then he will be safe, or at least safer because Dumbledore will give Draco protection. I donno just a thought. |
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07-26-2005, 05:42 PM
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#25 (permalink)
| | Imp
Location: T.O. Canada Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 100
| heyyyyyy thats not fair!!!! i checked my book (and i live in canada but we get the UK version) and i dont have the sentence...but for some reason its kinda out of place there...i uno its just me
oh ya i forgot to add wut i think it means. to me it sounds like dumbledore was willing to fake draco's death but then whe goes on and says something like giving him protection and sending Order members...but that doesnt make sense if draco is *secretly* dead...
Last edited by blondy359 : 07-26-2005 at 05:44 PM.
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