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| | The Graveyard Death Eater and Lord Voldemort Fan Club. Beware this bunch. |
12-01-2008, 01:21 PM
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#1 (permalink)
|   Ministry RPG/KA/FC Mod LV/DEFC Prez/DP Journalist Yearbook Editor Runespoor
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In Your Dreams
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Antonio Dumont Graduated Ministry RPG Name:
Samantha Rose Minister's Office | TG Topic #23 - Nobody's Perfect SS Featured Writer Lovely Lady
Here's a pretty interesting topic for discussion -
What do you think were the basic flaws that led to the Dark Lord's undoing? What do you think he could have done differently so that he might have triumphed?
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12-01-2008, 11:27 PM
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#2 (permalink)
| Neville's Activities Officer Remus's Birthday Officer DFC Activity Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Patrick Malkin Third Year | SuperClaw Amie de Rogue ♥
Good question. I think that he put too little stock in the value 'love & friendship' as a whole. He grossly misunderstood Harry's penchant to protect his loved ones too. The boy had matured immensely during that hunt for Horcruxes and was ready to sacrifice himself for the good of all. I doubt that the DL would have stretched himself to that limit for his cause.
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12-02-2008, 05:45 PM
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#3 (permalink)
| MEMFC/MMFC Secretary GWFC/RLFC Activities JKRFC News Poltergeist
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| Neville's Bravery
Firstly, I think he was afraid of death and that's what lead to his destruction. His mother had died early, and that's probably what instilled the fear in him. If he hadn't been afraid to die in the first place, he wouldn't have gone to such extremes to ensure that he never died. From then on, he was carved into the monster he became. His first murder was to create a horcrux, and the murders that followed those were for the same reason.
I don't think it was ever about purifying the wizard race and getting rid of muggle borns. He just went that way to ensure he had followers. It all started because he wanted to be immortal.
The only reason he went after Harry was because he was the one who could destroy him, it had nothing to do with his blood status. He wanted immortality and would have done anything to attain it.
Secondly, I must agree with mmesnape, that he did underestimate the true power of love and attachment. He had no experience of this feeling, so it was not really his fault that he did not understand its power.
He put too much into hiding from death, that he could have lived a full life if he wanted. Once someone goes down that path, their destruction is inevitable.
Last edited by Ginevra_P; 12-02-2008 at 06:03 PM.
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12-02-2008, 10:35 PM
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#4 (permalink)
|   Ministry RPG/KA/FC Mod LV/DEFC Prez/DP Journalist Yearbook Editor Runespoor
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In Your Dreams
Posts: 30,248
Hogwarts RPG Name: Antonio Dumont Graduated Ministry RPG Name:
Samantha Rose Minister's Office | SS Featured Writer Lovely Lady
I agree with both of you. He never did understand what love is, he had no concept of it, and that's why he misunderstood what the true power of love really is. Unfortunately, Tom never knew love his whole life, and that's the tragedy of his life. It just shows what can happen when a child grows up without love.
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Last edited by Slytherin Fox; 10-03-2009 at 06:21 AM.
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12-03-2008, 03:20 AM
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#5 (permalink)
|  Yearbook Copy Cat WWW Moderator Occamy
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Anastasia R. Bunbury Graduated Ministry RPG Name:
Enrico Antonio Serio Daily Prophet | Professor Pink | | I'm on a Goat
Oh man, clearly ya'll are missing the whole point (and theme) of JKR's books. Voldemort never received enough hugs and/or sugar as a child.
That's his one tragic flaw. Plain and simple folks, he had a horrid childhood and grew strong by preying on others and more or less being a bully. Just look at his days at the orphanage...and then he became addicted to power as a prefect at Hogwarts....really though, if someone had just given him a hug a day, he would have turned out alright in the end.
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12-03-2008, 03:46 AM
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#6 (permalink)
| Neville FC President Bella FC VP Graveyard Promotions Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: The Diva: Paris Emily Greenwood Fifth Year Ministry RPG Name:
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Originally Posted by BanaBatGirl Oh man, clearly ya'll are missing the whole point (and theme) of JKR's books. Voldemort never received enough hugs and/or sugar as a child.
That's his one tragic flaw. Plain and simple folks, he had a horrid childhood and grew strong by preying on others and more or less being a bully. Just look at his days at the orphanage...and then he became addicted to power as a prefect at Hogwarts....really though, if someone had just given him a hug a day, he would have turned out alright in the end.  He didn't have a horrid childhood. He was in a orphanage. That doesn't mean that you have a horrid childhood. I'm not comfortable with equating bad childhoods with being an orphan. That just sends out the wrong message to those who didn't grow up with their parents.
I mean they took the children to the seaside every summer and when Dumbledore went to visit him the children were playing and making noise. And Harry grew up without his parents and never having a hug nor lots of sugar. Did that turn him into a monster? No it didn't.
Voldemort was just a horrible human being from birth and there are people out there like that. Nothing about there lack of hugs or love or too much love or hugs would have changed how they ended up.
His undoing was underestimating people based on his prejudices. He didn't think that a house elf's magic was as good as a wizard so thats how Kreatcher and Regulus were able to get the locket. He didn't think that muggleborns were even good enough to learn magic so he never went after Hermione to separate her from Harry.
He never thought love was a worthy enough emotion for him to pay attention to it.
He was blinded by his hindsight.
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12-04-2008, 01:43 AM
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#7 (permalink)
|  Yearbook Copy Cat WWW Moderator Occamy
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Originally Posted by Tomasina Riddle He didn't have a horrid childhood. He was in a orphanage. That doesn't mean that you have a horrid childhood. I'm not comfortable with equating bad childhoods with being an orphan. That just sends out the wrong message to those who didn't grow up with their parents.
I mean they took the children to the seaside every summer and when Dumbledore went to visit him the children were playing and making noise. And Harry grew up without his parents and never having a hug nor lots of sugar. Did that turn him into a monster? No it didn't.
Voldemort was just a horrible human being from birth and there are people out there like that. Nothing about there lack of hugs or love or too much love or hugs would have changed how they ended up.
His undoing was underestimating people based on his prejudices. He didn't think that a house elf's magic was as good as a wizard so thats how Kreatcher and Regulus were able to get the locket. He didn't think that muggleborns were even good enough to learn magic so he never went after Hermione to separate her from Harry.
He never thought love was a worthy enough emotion for him to pay attention to it.
He was blinded by his hindsight.  I was joking, Tommy, I certainly wasn't making a statement against orphans. Look at Harry Potter, a hero AND an orphan! See!
Really though, Voldemort didn't have the best childhood if you think about it though....from the condition of the orphanage to the er, questionable woman running it. Voldemort could have made the most of his young life and maintained a positive outlook, but instead he chose to obsess over his parents and his lineage though - and doesn't that relate to childhood? Hating his father before he ever met him? Perhaps a few hugs would have done him good.
So I really think Voldemort had multiple character flaws, one of which just sprang from an unstable childhood. Oh, and a biiiiiig lust for power was another flaw.  Voldie was always trying to control things he couldn't necessarily do, like trying to stay at Hogwarts over the summer and trying to save himself from death. Power-hungry.
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12-04-2008, 04:15 PM
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#8 (permalink)
| Neville's Activities Officer Remus's Birthday Officer DFC Activity Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Patrick Malkin Third Year | SuperClaw Amie de Rogue ♥
I think that Voldie had an over abundance of ego... he thought he was the greatest wizard in the world! With a mindset like that, he considered everyone else inferior in skill, blood lineage, intelligence, etc...etc... So he was bound to trip up because he didn't properly evaluate a foe's strength; he downplayed their possible talents or even laughed at them, calling them weak and/or gullible or sub-par. If he hadn't been that way, i doubt that he would have trivialized Dumbledore's strategies to protect the wizarding world and Harry.
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12-04-2008, 04:44 PM
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#9 (permalink)
| Luna FC Promotions Officer Diricawl
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Mariel Genevieve Morgan Fourth Year Ministry RPG Name:
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Originally Posted by mmesnape I think that Voldie had an over abundance of ego... he thought he was the greatest wizard in the world! With a mindset like that, he considered everyone else inferior in skill, blood lineage, intelligence, etc...etc... So he was bound to trip up because he didn't properly evaluate a foe's strength; he downplayed their possible talents or even laughed at them, calling them weak and/or gullible or sub-par. If he hadn't been that way, i doubt that he would have trivialized Dumbledore's strategies to protect the wizarding world and Harry. Haha, I was just coming in here to say pretty much the same thing...
I always got the impression (at least from HBP and DH) that Voldie/Tom thought he was pretty awesome. When he first meets Dumbledore, he even says something along the lines like knowing he was special (or in his eyes, better than everyone else, especially in the orphanage). I think that's part of the reason why he bullied some of the kids - to show them how he thought he was better than them, and he could do magic which they couldn't - another trait that made him think of himself as superior. Then, once he gets to Hogwarts, he finds out that he's the descendent of a pretty great and famous wizard - another huge ego boost - not to mention he was a remarkably good student.
But... he thought he was so awesome, that overconfidence came into play and I think that's what really led to his downfall. He was so sure that he was the only one who knew of the Room of Requirement, that no one else would ever figure out his secret of the horcrux, that he was undefeatable. I think his overconfidence led to carelessness, causing him to make a few crucial mistakes and eventually led to his defeat.
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12-05-2008, 04:44 PM
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#10 (permalink)
| Neville's Activities Officer Remus's Birthday Officer DFC Activity Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Patrick Malkin Third Year | SuperClaw Amie de Rogue ♥
Hear, hear!! |
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12-10-2008, 05:45 PM
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#11 (permalink)
| Neville FC President Bella FC VP Graveyard Promotions Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: The Diva: Paris Emily Greenwood Fifth Year Ministry RPG Name:
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Originally Posted by BanaBatGirl  I was joking, Tommy, I certainly wasn't making a statement against orphans. Look at Harry Potter, a hero AND an orphan! See!
Really though, Voldemort didn't have the best childhood if you think about it though....from the condition of the orphanage to the er, questionable woman running it. Voldemort could have made the most of his young life and maintained a positive outlook, but instead he chose to obsess over his parents and his lineage though - and doesn't that relate to childhood? Hating his father before he ever met him? Perhaps a few hugs would have done him good.
So I really think Voldemort had multiple character flaws, one of which just sprang from an unstable childhood. Oh, and a biiiiiig lust for power was another flaw.  Voldie was always trying to control things he couldn't necessarily do, like trying to stay at Hogwarts over the summer and trying to save himself from death. Power-hungry.  I am just a little sensitive about that issue. Its one of the ways people use to manipulate children and traffic them. So thats a bit a of a soft spot for me
But I would never be mad at my Ironpuff!!!
I think Voldie was just a rotten egg from the get go and nothing anyone did would have changed him fro the better. Weather he had the best childhood with two loving parents or of he had grown up the way he did. He was just evil and he used what he lacked in his life to justify what he did.
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05-24-2009, 03:58 PM
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#12 (permalink)
| | Squib Chizpurfle
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Hogwarts RPG Name: Bayle Connor Fifth Year Ministry RPG Name:
Heather Clearwater Magical Maintenance | Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomasina Riddle I mean they took the children to the seaside every summer and when Dumbledore went to visit him the children were playing and making noise. And Harry grew up without his parents and never having a hug nor lots of sugar. Did that turn him into a monster? No it didn't. Even though Harry didn't get many hugs while growing up he did meet friends at Hogwarts who cared about him and that is what made him good. Voldemort had followers who helped him get power which turned him into a bad person because he began to crave for more. Harry never wanted power he was happy with what he got.
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07-27-2009, 05:48 PM
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#13 (permalink)
| Neville FC President Bella FC VP Graveyard Promotions Officer Acromantula
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Hogwarts RPG Name: The Diva: Paris Emily Greenwood Fifth Year Ministry RPG Name:
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Originally Posted by Rubb3r DuckE Even though Harry didn't get many hugs while growing up he did meet friends at Hogwarts who cared about him and that is what made him good. Voldemort had followers who helped him get power which turned him into a bad person because he began to crave for more. Harry never wanted power he was happy with what he got. No I don't think thats correct because in the home he was living in he was hurting people. He told Dumbledore that when he went to see about him. Tom could have had friends at Hogwarts he was a charming boy and everyone loved him, but he didn't return those feelings and so instead of those people he had around them turning into friends they turned in followers and sycophants.
Having or not having friends doesn't turn a person good or bad.
Voldemort didn't need anyone to help him gain power. He did that own his own. Good or bad, Voldemort was a exceptional wizard, he studied and learned as much about magic as he could. So I think he still would have reigned down terror it just would have taken him longer to get to the top of the naughty list if he didn't have help.
Petunia had the love of her sister but she let her jealous poison her. Peter had 3 great friends who were ready to lay down and die for him and he still acted like a git and betrayed them. Snape had been picked on by Potter and Black his whole life yet he gave up his life to protect Harry, no matter how much he disliked his father.
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